P0410 Air check valve closes after 10 seconds on Cold Start

[gladesteen]

Howdy......2004 Olds Bravada issue here.
From what I understand, the secondary air system should run for about 30 to 40 seconds on a cold start. Mine doesn't. Only 10 seconds on a bone cold start.
I've been chasing this P0410 code for awhile now and decided to try and figure it out.
The 3 air system Fuses have been checked and verified good.
I know the Secondary air pump underneath is working, I can touch it, hear it and feel it working. I swapped out the relay next to the pump and that did not fix the early shutoff issue.
The check valve in the engine is definitely closing off after 10 seconds. Regardless if the motor is warm or dead cold. I can put my hand on the check valve and feel and hear it slam shut.
What controls the check valve? Is it internal and just needs to be replaced even though its opening and closing? I'm assuming once the check valve slams shut, that triggers the blower to shut off. If it's just a faulty check valve closing off after 10 seconds, then I have the new one and gasket. I also have a new blower motor, but dont want to throw parts if its something else like a relay I dont know about,etc.
The fuses I checked, verified and swapped were 54, 55 and 56

 

[mrrsm]

Jimmy from his "1ROAD Garage " YT Channel has an interesting Diagnostic and Repair approach for this P0410 Trouble Code Well Worth Watching:

 

[gladesteen]

I watched. It did not help anything.
As I mentioned the Check valve IS WORKING. I can hear it and feel it close shut.
And as this video author states, the entire system should run for about 30 seconds on a cold start.
Mine only runs for 10 no matter if its cold or warm. The Check valve closes, the blower stops after only 10 seconds. That's my isssue. And for some reason, it keeps throwing a P0141 code because of it.

I may as well just swap out the valve and blower anyway since I have the parts.

Was hoping someone had a reason the system shuts down after 10 seconds and wont run the full 30 second cycle.

 

[azswiss]

Before you swap out the parts check to see if the system enters "closed loop mode" at the same time as the pump shuts down (you will need a scanner that provides live data or an app like Torque Pro).

What you are looking for is if the pump shuts down while the system is still in open loop mode.

If the system goes into closed loop at the same time the secondary air system shuts down that means the pump is being instructed to shut down vs. shutting down by itself.

 

[gladesteen]

I did some more digging on this and someone had this years ago. Turned out it was the Blower Motor internals damaged from getting water. Would run for a bit, then overload PCM parameters and the computer would shut the whole system down. Makes sense. I've not changed the pump motor in probably 10 years. I actually have 2 of them on hand, so I will swap out and see what happens. Will report back.

 

[budwich]

From what I understand, the secondary air system should run for about 30 to 40 seconds on a cold start. Mine doesn't. Only 10 seconds on a bone cold start.

My read from the SM is that the system will run for less than 25 seconds .... but that does not matter at this point since you are probably on the right track about the pump.... maybe. The pump has an internal circuit breaker for protection so maybe it is "firing" resulting in the pump stopping..... BUT the SM makes a note that the p0410 code can be set because of an O2 issue... since as part of the tests that run, the results depend on the response of the O2 sensor. IF the O2 sensor has some issue, the SM says that it can set the P0410 (which is getting set from the testing not from normal O2 operation which may NOT see the issue as O2 for various reasons)... clear as mud right! Ultimately, it appears that you having both a "functional" valve and pump as you have reported so just maybe...

Anyway, if you have a spare pump, it costs nothing to switch it out (other than time and "fingers")... but perhaps don't be surprised, if the code returns or does not go away. Again, my read on the SM.

 

[azswiss]

I did some more digging on this and someone had this years ago. Turned out it was the Blower Motor internals damaged from getting water. Would run for a bit, then overload PCM parameters and the computer would shut the whole system down. Makes sense. I've not changed the pump motor in probably 10 years. I actually have 2 of them on hand, so I will swap out and see what happens. Will report back.

The pump is powered thru a relay (the ground side of which is connected thru the PCM). Have you tried swapping the relay?

 

[gladesteen]

My read from the SM is that the system will run for less than 25 seconds .... but that does not matter at this point since you are probably on the right track about the pump.... maybe.

I swapped out the pump and so far it's not sent a code. It does seem to be running very rich however and the last time I swapped out both the O2 sensors was in 2011. They're definitely due for a change.
I may try the Denso versions versus the GM ones.

Still not out of the woods as I've only driven about 10 miles after changing the relay and pump. But fingers crossed.

 

[gladesteen]

The pump is powered thru a relay (the ground side of which is connected thru the PCM). Have you tried swapping the relay?

That was the first thing I swapped. After checking fuses.
Changed out the pump today and drove it about 10 miles. So far no code.
I'm going to swap out the O2 sensors as well. They're due. Well over 10 years old and probably close to 100k on them.

 

[azswiss]

I swapped out the relay next to the pump and that did not fix the early shutoff issue.

Missed it . . . doh!